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Found new factual info for Barbara Hall if anyone can help. A copy of a letter dated 1932 to Mr O'Mahony asking for help in proving that Barbara Hall alias Vera Lowe was a O'Mahony. At that time she was living with who she believed to be her grandmother Frances Lowe nee O'Mahony and her grandmother's husband Thomas Lowe in Sutton Coldfield and was called Vera Lowe. I have found her living with them in 1921. The letter mentions Barbara being taken by Mrs Sinclair to live the Forbes when she was 2 and then Mrs Sinclair came and took her to Carr's home, Northbrook Road, Dublin and then to Mrs Irwin in Dublin. Mrs Irwin had then moved to America. It's all so fascinating and everything Barbara told her family now appears to be true. I don't know where to start??

As I said much earlier my Veronica A Griffin was born in Surrey not Watford. I am researching for old friend Charles Dimmock, Veronica's son. I know he has just put his tree on Ancestry and may of added details of our first find of Barbara ( his grandmother). I will ask Charles to fill in any blanks by joining this thread as he has now joined Genes reunited and I am relaying info 2nd hand.

The owner of the tree looks to be the daughter of Veronica's sister,it looks very well researched.

it keeps us occupied.

Maryb

Mary- I agree with you- lots of crossed wires!

I think we need to know how Nicola got to Veronica- what Nicola's connection to the family is and work from there.

found this info on ancestry tree with photos of Veronica Ann Griffin and her parents wedding


Anastatia O'Mahony 10/9/1915 Killmallock co limerick to James O'Mahony and Brigid Meyer. they have copy of baptism. She died 3/3/1974 Bushey Herts

Anastatia married Charles William Griffin born 29/3 1906 in South shields (Michael on record ) married 18/5/1942 Watford he died 4/6/1978 Watford
They had Veronica Ann Griffin born 21/12/1942 died Watford 2014 from MS and Pneumonia it also says she didn't marry!!


Brigid Melyer 1888-1950 married James O'Mahony 1872-1915 he was son of Daniel
Brigid daughter of Patrick and Anastasia Power, Brigid also had sister Anastasia

Maryb.

Seems to be a lot of crossed wires with this family.

The one born in Watford married in Watford in 1965 had a daughter 1965 and son 1966,he has a tree on Ancestry.co.uk with Charles O' Mahoney 1884-1944 the one from 1939 census in Esher with parents James and Bridget.
He also has Barbara Hall daughter of Mary O'Mahoney

Maryb.

It seems probable that she is the Surrey one.

Cuthbert and Barbara were at "Kavana", Ferry Road, Chertsey, Surrey in 1945:

Cuthbert J Griffin
in the Surrey, England, Electoral Registers, 1832-1962
Name: Cuthbert J Griffin
Residence Year: 1945
Parliamentary Division/Constituency: Chertsey
Residence Place: Surrey, England

They were still there in 1960.


Also at the same address in 1945 (probably lodgers ): Arthur A Steinberg and Constance Fergusson-Foden
( Irrelevant, but interesting and sad: Constance was a patient in a Home for Inebriates in Surrey in 1939. She was also a pianist (LRAM ).

If Veronica is still alive then is she the one Born Surrey mum nee Hall or Watford mum nee O'Mahoney.


Maryb

Nicola- are you sure of those details?

There is a Charles K O'Mahoney at the Old Red Cottage, Esher in 1939.

His wife is listed as Julia C

This looks to be their marriage:- note Charles father is listed as Thomas (not James):


Name: Charles Kingston O Mahony (Journalist)
Gender: Male
Marriage Age: 25
Record Type: Marriage
Birth Date: abt 1885
Marriage Date: 19 Mar 1910
Marriage Place: St Peter, Staines Parishes not in a Borough, Surrey, England
Father: Thomas Kingston O Mahony (Gentleman)
Spouse
Julia Christine Ellis
Father: Charles Ellis

Witnesses on Barbara's marriage cert were E O J Hughes and A Temple No father info for Barbara.

Yes Veronica is still alive, the family say there is a connection with Charles O'Mahony living in the red house in Esher, he was there in 1939 and there is a family connection with this house. Charles O'Mahony's parents were James O'Mahony B 1851 Kerry and Bridget born 1851, Kildare.

Did Barbara's daughter Veronica A Griffin nee Hall 1943 marry and is she still alive.


Maryb.

You still haven't answered about Barbara's address and witnesses on her marriage certificate. Unless I've missed it

I wonder how she ended up in Pocklington, where she married.

I am getting bits of info but apparently Barbara's maternal grandmother left Ireland because of relationship with the gardener, who she married and they lived in Sutton Coldfield. Barbara visited them in 1919 and both Grandmother and husband died soon after and Barbara returned to Ireland. At some point Barbara was in a nunnery too, nothing making much sense but I appreciate your help.

In desperation, re Barbara - and assuming her stated Dublin birth is correct:

????

SR District/Reg Area - Dublin
Birth of UNKNOWN WILLIAMS on 13 September 1907
Name UNKNOWN WILLIAMS
Date of Birth 13 September 1907
Group Registration ID 694887
SR District/Reg Area Dublin
Sex Female
Mother's Birth Surname WILLIAMS [Ethel Williams, unmarried ]


OR -

SR District/Reg Area - Dublin
Birth of CATHERINE WILLIAMS on 23 November 1908
Name CATHERINE WILLIAMS
Date of Birth 23 November 1908
Group Registration ID 616619
SR District/Reg Area Dublin
Sex Female
Mother's Birth Surname WILLIAMS [ Maggie Williams, unmarried ]


OR -

SR District/Reg Area - Dublin
Birth of LIZZIE WILLIAMS on 24 August 1908
Name LIZZIE WILLIAMS
Date of Birth 24 August 1908
Group Registration ID 540683
SR District/Reg Area Dublin
Sex Female
Mother's Birth Surname WILLIAMS [ Lizzie Williams, unmarried ]


OR -


SR District/Reg Area - Dublin

Birth of LILLIE WILLIAMS on 05 January 1908
Name LILLIE WILLIAMS
Date of Birth 05 January 1908
Group Registration ID 575270
SR District/Reg Area Dublin
Sex Female
Mother's Birth Surname WILLIAMS [ Lilian Agnes Williams, unmarried ]

Parents Alfred Thomas Hall and Elizabeth Hall formerly Williams:

SR District/Reg Area - Belfast
Birth of WINIFRED HALL on 13 January 1900
Name WINIFRED HALL
Date of Birth 13 January 1900
Group Registration ID 60237
SR District/Reg Area Belfast
Sex Female
Mother's Birth Surname WILLIAMS

So parents' marriage:

Marriages Sep 1895 (>99%)
Hall Alfred Thomas Stockport 8a 12
Williams Elizabeth Stockport 8a 12



So I suppose it's possible that Barbara's mother MIGHT be a daughter of Elizabeth, born before 1895.


But equally possible that Elizabeth is a complete red herring.

The family certainly moved around.
Changes in stated POB's doesn't help:

Winifred Hall
in the Web: Ireland, Census, 1901
Name: Winifred Hall
Gender: Female
Age: 1
Birth Year: abt 1900
Relation to Head: Daughter
Residence Date: 31 Mar 1901
Townland/Street: Cyprus Park
District: Pottinger
County: Down
Household Members:
Name Age
Alfred Thomas Hall 32 - drapers buyer, Shropshire.
Elizabeth Hall 33 - Co Wicklow
Winifred Hall 1 - Co Down
Isabella Murray 16 - servant

I don't see any O'Mahoneys in Sutton Coldfield in 1911 - though of course they could have moved there between 1911 and 1919.

There are a number of Halls there in 1911, including this woman born in Dublin:

Elizabeth Hall
in the 1911 England Census
Name: Elizabeth Hall
Age in 1911: 43
Estimated birth year: abt 1868
Relation to Head: Wife
Gender: Female
Birth Place: Dublin, Dublin, Ireland
Civil Parish: Sutton Coldfield
County/Island: Warwickshire
Country: England
Street address: Hazelmead Chester Road Birmingham
Marital status: Married
Registration district: Aston
Registration District Number: 385
Sub-registration district: Sutton Coldfield
ED, institution, or vessel: 2
Piece: 18373
Household Members:
Name Age
Alfred Thomas Hall 42
Elizabeth Hall 43
Winnifred Hall 11 - Belfast
Margaret Benson 39 - nurse (domestic)
Ida Biddle 20 - servant

Married 15 years.

If Barbara's mother was Irish, as you've said, one would assume at least one of her parents to have been Irish.

In that case, her mother can't be one of John O'Mahony's sisters.

Barbara certainly used that DOB in 1939 - but that doesn't help us know when she was actually born - it may have been several years out.

In 1939 she can't have used Philip's day and month of birth, as he wasn't born until the following year.