Genealogy Chat

After 10 years of looking I think I may have found a long dead relative who went missing in 1906.

John Troop born 1874. He was born in Gainsboro...He came to Liverpool and got married my husbands gg nan. They married October 1900 had their 1st baby 5th Nov 1900( no rush there).By the 1901 April census John had moved out and was living in a lodging/boarding house in the next street but classing himself as single??The story the baby or Little Nan as she was called said he dad (John) had gone to San Fransisco in 1906 and was killed in the earthquake. Her mam did in 1911 from a broken heart ! and even though Nan was living with her grand parents they put her in an orphange then when she was old enough she went into service. She got married had 2 children and had a happy life.
From 2002 Ive been trying to find John Troop. No record of him going to America. So Ive only got a few days left of my subscription so thought Id do one last death search for him. I started at 1906 and did it year by year. There was a few deaths but none matches his age at the time. Then I came across on in JFM1972 looked it up and thankfully it gave his DOB 21st Feb 1874. So I got the birth cert out for John I knew it was 1874 etched on my brain that date lol....and Johns DOB is 21st Feb 1874.Now this John has the same birthday. Now for the fun bit ! Is there anyone out there that lives in Waltham Forest as this is the area given for his death who would know of a site that I can check on or help me in any way. It would be nice to start 2013 knowing I dont have to keep looking for John Troop :-) :-)
Thanks Everyone.

Cant think of a site. Would it be worth getting the death cert to see who the informant was.

The obvious solution is to buy the death cert.......to find out who the informant was, and his/her relationship to the deceased.

I thought Id have to do that have to wait till after xmas now lol...Thanks

On the Electoral Roll for London N15 between 1948 and 1956 there is a John Troop living with Frederick G Murray and Isabel K Murray at 158 West Green Road N15. Also Gertrude E Cato and Charles Monk for most of that period.

From 1964-65 there is a John Troop living with Alice C Troop at 8 Union Road Walthamstow.

As I expect you have checked he does not appear on the list of San Francisco earthquake victims.
http://www.sfmuseum.org/perished/index.html


Edit 15:05
Just noticed the previous thread
http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards/board/ancestors/thread/1294081

Thanks for that KenSE Ive been looking for John since 2002 but I always seemed to hit a brick wall. The America story is what his daughter (LIttle Nan) told her children we never knew where she got it from maybe her mam told her . But he wasnt living with them in April 1901 and they had only got married the October before.

I tend to leave John alone for a while then start all over again looking for him lol..Like today I just thought as Ive only got a few days left on here Id give him another go. So I started with the deaths from 1906 when he is suppose to have died. Did it year by year then in 1972 his name came up and when I checked it gave his DOB as 21st Feb 1874 he was the only John born in that year.

I will try and find a marriage for the lady you gave me...hope I dont come upto another brick wall lol..

Of the people living in West Green Road:

Gertrude E Cato died at Edmonton, Middlesex in Q4 1962 aged 79. She married Edwin James Cato in Q4 1904 at St Giles district and her maiden name was Gertrude Emma Watkins.

Frederick G Murray married Isabel K Monk at Edmonton in Q4 1932.

The Edmonton district is adjacent to Waltham Forest.

KenSE thanks for all the info Ive learnt more in the last hour than I have in a long time lol.

John married Alice Clara in 1956

John was 82 !
Clara was 53.

Im wondering with all the different people living at the same address if it was a boarding house.

Cant believe John was 82 when he got married again .

John died 1972 aged 98
Clara died 1989 aged 86.

She was 53 when they married so I shouldnt imagine there was any children from the marriage....Thanks again KenSE.

I wonder if there was some significance about them marrying so late in life - he was a widow, so I wonder if she was also married previously and had never divorced??

Hiya Flip,
From what Ive looked at Clara's first marriage was at 53 to John. Wursten was her maiden name and her parents surnames aswell.


John died in 1972 and Clara in 1989 so Im wondering which would be the best death cert to order??? Id think Clara would have been the one to register Johns death.

Scrub my last remark, she was still a spinster - her mother's probate record:

Clara Wursten
Probate Date: 16 Apr 1956
Death Date: 28 Oct 1955
Death Place: Widow
Registry: London, England

Clara Wursten of 8 Union Rd Walthamstow E17, widow, died at Whipps Cross hospital, probate to Alice Clara Wursten, spinster. Effect £270

Yes, Clara would be the most likely to register John's death.

So in 1964/5 they were living at the mother's address - wonder how long they had been together! I'll see if I can find the Wursten's on other ERs.

Oh well, no luck with finding the Wursten's on any ERs. But as he was at West Green Road until his marriage in 1956 they obvioulsy weren't "living together" in advance of the marriage. I also can't find John in London ERs between 1956 and 1964 when he shows up with Alice Clara at the mother's address.

Highly unlikely they had any children, so not sure what getting a death certificate will prove?

I wonder?? - can only see one John Troop born in Lincolnshire in the 5 years around his birth - maybe he was married again? ;-) ;-)

John Troop
Age in 1911: 35
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1876
Relation to Head: Head
Gender: Male
Birth Place: Gainsborough, Lincolnshire, England
Civil parish: Rotherham
County/Island: Yorkshire-West Riding
Country: England
Street Address: 28 Hatherley Road Rotherham
Marital Status: Married
Occupation: Planer In Steel Wks
Registration district: Rotherham
Registration District Number: 511
Sub-registration district: South East Rotherham
ED, institution, or vessel: 15
Piece: 28057
Household Members: Name Age
John Troop 35
Florence Troop 31
Doris Troop 5
Elsie Troop 2

Or maybe not, there were 2 John Troop's born in Gainsboro:

Births Jun 1873 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Troop John Gainsbro' 7a 682

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Births Mar 1874 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Troop John Gainsbro' 7a 722

But the one married to Florence Askew was listed as John Alfred?

Hiya Flip,
Yea thats the other John I thought was my John he was on the railways.Troop was a very common name around that area. But this other John on the register it gives his date of birth as 21st Feb 1874, I checked his birth cert and its the same date. He was a bit of a rum un was John if he didnt die till 72 I wonder why he never came looking for his daughter as she was still alive then.
He married little Nans mam October 31st 1900 little Nan was born 5th November 1900..wonder how big the bouquet was to cover a 9 month bump lol. But by the next census in 1901 John had moved out ..and was living in the 2nd half of the road telling the census man he was SINGLE...How long he had been there we will never know but the marriage didnt last that long 6 months at the most. Little Nans mam died in 1911 suppose to be from a broken heart but it was a brain thing. Nan was living with her grand[parents and they put her into an orphange at 11 yrs old. Then she went into service..got married had 2 children..and lived a happy life.Looking at what her dad got up to I wonder if thats where she got the ability to cheat at cards or games lol

Maybe she was better off without him - she did alright by the sounds of it, and he didn't stay around long enough to even know her. Bit of a chancer by the looks of it.

Must have been a very large bouquet for her mum!!

Well, you've been looking for him for years, but it looks like you now have his death & his very late marriage, and the new wife's death. I think that death cert you have with the right dob is pretty conclusive. What an age though, 98!

So, you're going to abandon your GR sub? Have you considered getting the basic sub, which is really cheap, that way you can still participate on the "boards". It's all I have on here (have Ancestry sub though), and I have great fun trying to help people or do a bit of research on my tree. You can still post, and helpers with Ancestry or FMP subs will try to help (like I do)

atb
Flip

Thanks Flip,

You know what it feels really weird finally finding John Troop. Like I said been looking for him for 10 years and now its all over feel a bit lost now lol.I know this will sound really strange and you dont have to answer me but a couple of weeks ago I went to see a clairvoyant she was pretty good as well and kept going on about a man in the army and she could see other soldiersI said the mans name is Troop. I know clutching at straws lol.. Anyway she said did I have a question for him and I laughingly said "YEAAAAA where the hell has he been and can he let me find him" Well here I am finally finding him lol...could be just one of those things but Id like to think he was there that night lol....How much is the basic sub??

basic subs for 6 month is £10 or just under
can not remember as mine is on auto re-new

shelly xx

Hello eveyone .
Just got the infamous John Troops 2nd marriage certificate. Wellllll lol
He and Alice Clara both lived at 8 Union Road, E17.

They got married th July 26th 1956. John was 68 and as for his condition he says hes a "batchelor" :-0 Alice was a spinster she was 53 years old.

Technically he was a widower mind you I dont suppose he would have known that as he did a runner in 1901 lol.

Im wondering if he got married between 1900 and 1956 lot of years that lol.
Elaine :-D