Genealogy Chat

Children were often married as young as five in early medieval England amonst royalty and peerage. Marriages were negotiated by the fathers with a view to gain more land and inheritance. The marriages were more of a betrothal and not consumated till later.

mimo7 ..........

Welcome to the Boards

That rounding down only occurs on the 1841 Census, when the ages of people over the age of 15 were to be rounded down to the nearest 5. One has to remember that not all enumerators obeyed those rules!

On all other censuses, there was no official rounding down or up. People were asked to give their age on the night of the census. The modern-day transcribers then had to change those ages into estimated birth year.

Whether the birth year is accurate depends on .............

did the person know their own age, or the age of anyone else in the household

did the person tell the truth

the date of the census compared with the birth date .......... someone whose birthday occurred after the census was taken will appear to be one year younger than you expect after age is changed to estimated birth year.

This is why the census transcription always shows the birth year as "ca 1863" (as an example)

As far as spelling or names is concerned ..... remember that most of our ancestors were in fact completely illiterate, while many of the enumerators were only slightly more literate. Some one who is illiterate cannot correct the spelling of their name. But even supposedly educated people, such as the local priest, is known to write how they think the name should be spelled, not as WE spell it now.

and, indeed, how do we know that the spelling that we now use for our own names is the correct one?

Moral ...........

always search for birth years as year +/-2; +/-5 on the 1841,

Always use wild cards to account for possible alternative spellings.


as for being "justifiably outraged" ................... are you outraged when you have to give information on a census?

@GlasgowLass , As I have found out in my own research , the enumerators quite often rounded up or down the ages of people. They often misspelt their names or guessed the way it should be spelt. Most people were justifiably enraged at having to give personal details so the enumerators were often in a hurry to finish and leave. :-0

Sylvia - brings back memories of vinyl records.
Great balls of fire on Phillips 10" was reputedly the queen's favourite.
In the late 1960s in Washington state, the legal minimum age for marriage was 12 for females, and 14 for males (with parental permission in the case of minors - under in WA 21 back then).
Cousin marrs are something else - 30 states prohibit all (or nearly all) first cousin marriages.

Yes, although not at the time. It's brought up whenever JLL's career is discussed.
Not sure who benefits when children are allowed to marry so young. Pedophiles or recognition that adolescents are going to 'experiment'?

does anyone else remember, or remember hearing about, the American rock n roller Jerry Lee Lewis arriving in the UK in 1958 for a British tour, with his new bride, his 3rd wife ............. he married his 3rd cousin ca 1957 when he was 22 and she was 13

It caused so much controversy that the tour was soon cancelled, and they went back home. But the controversy followed him to the US, and his career was all but destroyed for about 10 years.

His marriage was perfectly legal ..... both her age and their relationship was apparently quite common in the area of the US where they grew up

:-D We can only hope its a happy one :-D

and they said it wouldn't last :-D

Working on the US branch today, I was stunned to find that in Missouri, you can marry aged 15, with parental consent. They can also marry under the age of 15 as long as they have a court order! There was I thinking I'd picked up on the wrong record :-S

Born 18 Feb 1957
Married 19 Jun 1972

They are still together at the same address in the phone book!!!

If one looks up these names on the local (Kent) index:
http://webapps.kent.gov.uk/KCC.ROIS.Web.Sites.Public/Pages/Default.aspx

Name BALDOCK, Amelia
Year Of Marriage 1886
Entry Number 238
Register 38/1

Name CALLINGHAM, James
Year Of Marriage 1886
Entry Number 238
Register 38/1

Name HATCHER, Rosa
Year Of Marriage 1886
Entry Number 239
Register 38/1

Name MOUNT, Robert
Year Of Marriage 1886
Entry Number 239
Register 38/1

one can see who wed whom by matching the entry #s.
Kent doesn't decode the church ref (i.e., 38 - the /1 indicates it's their first register, I guess), so one can't say exactly where they wed from this.



In 1886 in England/Wa;es, there were 182462 marrs where both gave their age (plus a further 13609 marrs)
Of these 182462 brides, 23 were 15, plus one groom).
Source:
Forty-ninth annual report of the registrar-general Page 68
http://www.histpop.org/ohpr/servlet/Browse?path=Browse/Registrar%20General%20%28by%20date%29&active=yes&titlepos=0

I accidentally looked up 1888, and then there were 18 15 y.o. bides, plus 2 14 y.o.'s and 1 13 y.o.

I have one were both bride and groom were 14 years old ,I can remember googling to find if the ages were right as I thought it was young but it was quite common.

I have a marriage in my tree where the bride claimed to be 19yrs.
She was somewhere between 14 & 15 yrs

Mar 1861 census - age 9
Aug 1866 married stating 19yrs
Mar 1871 Original return has 19yrs scored out and replaced with 30yrs ( 4 children)
Jun 1877 died age 26yrs ( suicide)

My mums maternal gran was .15 years 3 months when she married .

Her younger sister was just. 15,when she married

Both husbands were around 21.yaers old . They both had a baby' within a year of being married

Back then girls could get married at 12, so I expect someone on here will have a younger marriage than 15 in their tree.

1891 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Staple Street, Staple Next Wingham, Eastry, Kent, England


Robert Mount Head Married Male 25 1866 Agricultural Labourer Goodnestone, Kent, England
Rosa Mount Wife Married Female 18 1873 - Goodnestone, Kent, England
Robert W Mount Son - Male 4 1887 - Canterbury, Kent, England T
Stephen Hatches Brother - Male 14 1877 Agricultural Labourer Goodnestone, Kent, England

Name Rosa Hatcher
Gender Female
Christening Date 25 Aug 1872
Christening Place Goodnestone (near Sandwich), Kent, England
Father's Name Stephen Hatcher
Mother's Name Charlotte

?????????????
Name Rosa Hatcher
Event Type Marriage
Registration Quarter Jul-Aug-Sep
Registration Year 1886
Registration District Bridge
County Kent
Event Place Bridge, Kent, England
Volume 2A
Page 1159
Line Number 134

Rosa Hatcher probably married one of the following people
Name James Callingham
Name Robert Mount

Rosa Hatcher aged 15 in 1886.
It's the youngest I have come across.