Genealogy Chat

I want to order the Army (pre WW2) / possible RAF records (during WW2) of Herbert Ashton Battersby. He has been on the family tree for 5 years and one of those individuals I couldn't figure out where he passed away. I am in contact within the family network with his grandchildren.

But before I ask some questions would like to know if this is allowed. Herbert was born Oct 6 1907 in Blackpool to Annie Battersby, a domestic servant no father declared. On his marriage record in 1930, he made up his fathers name as Herbert Ashton Battersby! On his 1944 2nd marriage to Violet Clodd the certificate says under his name Herbert Ashton Battersby Otherwise Herbert Ashton with fathers name blank. His death certificate received yesterday states Herbert Ashton passed away 16/12/1977 registered by his wife Violet Elsie Ashton (passed away 1986). Could he have changed his name by deed poll and how could you check. Has his mum told him his fathers surname name was Ashton? Does the state check that you must register your death using your birth surname. I do have plenty of example of family whose death registration with different forename order and including the odd confirmation names on top!

Has

3 possibilities really?

Herbert changed his surname by deedpoll ( unlikely as it seems Violet kept name Battersby?).

There was an error when Violet reg Herbert's death and it was written down as Ashton as the surname not middle name.

Herbert chose to use the name Ashton as his 'usually known by' surname and that is the name his death was registered in. You don't ( or didn't at least ) nec' have to produce birth cert to reg death, so the info given is only as good as the informant knows or gives at the time.

You can call yourself anything you wish, as long as there is no intent to deceive or defraud.

Impossible to enforce registering deaths in birth surname - think of adoptees.

For whatever reason he adopted his middle name as his chosen surname. I'll be asking one of his grandchildren on Messenger if they knew any reason why Herbert ditched Battersby. His son & his children from his 1st marriage kept the surname Battersby.so they were happy with it! He we was still called Uncle Bat on my wife's side so may be he hated that? :-)

What was on the birth certificate doesn't determine the chikd;s name.
A birth certificate registers a birth and namesthe mother and possibly the fayher.
It doesn't give the child a surname, nor does it follow that the child must use a parent's sutnames, a;though they usually do so.
A b.cert rego's a birth. It is not required that the child be given a forename. In 1907, there were over 2500 births rego'ed without a forename being given. If one had to use what was on the b.cert, Male would be 8 times more popular y=than Anthony or Bertram, and Female 3 times more poulat than Nancy.

Ashton Household (4 People)
25 Bourne Estate , Stroud R.D., Gloucestershire, England

FIRST NAME(S) LAST NAME(S) DOB SEX OCCUPATION MARITAL STATUS SCHEDULE SCHEDULE SUB NUMBER
Rose E Llewellyn (Battersby) 19 Apr 1903 Female Unpaid Domestic Duties Married 211 2
Herbert Ashton 06 Oct 1907 Male Fitter Aero Engine R A F Married 211 1

The record actually has his surname as Battersby, but the name Ashton has been superimposed in red, with Battersby crossed out

Also on the record is the following:

4120134 Private Cheshire Regt Reserve D.B/190C

I see that Rose also re-married in Stroud, a year after Herbert.

Thank you mgnv, this is a true story, my best friend used to work in the registration office in Lancashire, he had one individual wanting to register his child's name as "Shiny Red Balloon" and refused the parent :) He had a few others he stopped as well with inappropriate names.

Thank you ErikaH for sending the record, especially his reserve ref, he was a Solider at Aldershot Barracks on his 1930 marriage certificate so gives me supporting info when I apply for his army records with the death certificate I have.

21 Church St Fleetwood Lancashire, Fleetwood, Lancashire, England

Learn more

Print transcription View image Household Members
First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Sex Age Birth year Birth place Occupation
Ernest Albert Leah Head Married Male 39 1872 Openshaw Manchester Lancashire Wine Spirit Beer Dealer Transcription
Annie Leah Wife Married Female 40 1871 Edge Lane Droylsden Lancashire Home And Shop Transcription
Alice Leah Daughter Single Female 15 1896 Dukinfield Cheshire Nr Manchester Millenary Apprentice Transcription
***Herbert Ashton Battersby**** Nephew - Male 3 1908 Blackpool Lancashire - Transcription

1911 census.

Granddaughter in Portugal confirmed Grandpa Ashton was the offspring of a meeting of a housemaid and landed gentry well that was the gossip. She now knows her great grandmothers name. Lets hope it was like Upstairs Downstairs rather than Hollywood today. But from what I have seen Blackpool had Millions of visitor in the 1st half of the 20 century and was the holiday capital of Britain. She is networking with her brothers now one in England the other who is in the Falklands!

AndyTG - you might be interested in reading

Parents lose custody of girl for naming her Talula Does the Hula From Hawaii
https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2008/jul/24/familyandrelationships.newzealand

Very good article unbelievable parents out there, but on the positive side their descendants won't have any problem tracking them down :) In my birth home town the number 16 bus still would get me into the city centre and that stop has a shelter :)