Genealogy Chat

Dabbling, can't sleep, will remove the following posts if shown to be incorrect family

If the Netherton name is correct -

Samuel Netherton age 18 born Llanlivery, near Lostwithiel, Cornwall and a Carpenter enlisted 30.5.1863 at Plymouth to the Royal Artillery for a Bounty of £1 and free kit. Transferred to Army Service Corps April 1870

Previously in Royal Cornwall Rangers (Militia)

Served at Home (ie Britain) 1863-1878 and a month at home after Gibraltar before Discharge from Service at end of engagement.

He was in Gibraltar 1878-1883 accompanied by his wife.

Married Jane Lucy Ledford 1 April 1866 Plumstead

----------------------------------
Marr. Cert on Ancestry
Married at St Nicholas, Plumstead. Samuel was a gunner in the RA, Father William a Labourer.
Jane a spinster, Father was Edward Ledford also a Labourer
Both resident in Plumstead at time of marriage
Witnesses - W Fry and Esther Fry

Just to note -

on the 1911 censuse for Richard Samuel Howe, posted by ErikaH -
the Bakers are in a different household.
Another Ancestry mistranscription.

Richard is only with his grandmother and sister.

There's a note added below the children's names "Mother away"

???

Lucy Alice Howe
in the 1939 England and Wales Register
Name: Lucy Alice Howe [Lucy Alice Chandler]
Gender: Female
Marital Status: Widow
Birth Date: 24 Apr 1881
Residence Year: 1939
Address: Elmsbrook
Residence Place: Brentwood, Essex, England
Occupation: Attendant Children Clu?? [ Clinic ] - ARP First Aid
Line Number: 25
Schedule Number: 114
Sub Schedule Number: 1
Enumeration District: DBKY
Borough: Brentwood
Registration district: 193-1
Household Members Age
Lucy Alice Howe 58
John H Chandler 61


Marriages Sep 1948 (>99%)
Chandler John H Howe Brentwood 4a 1235
Howe Lucy A Chandler Brentwood 4a 1235



Lucy Alice Chandler
in the England & Wales, Civil Registration Death Index, 1916-2007
Name: Lucy Alice Chandler
Death Age: 92
Birth Date: 24 Apr 1881
Registration Date: Oct 1973
[Nov 1973]
[Dec 1973]
Registration Quarter: Oct-Nov-Dec
Registration District: Honiton
Inferred County: Devon
Volume: 7a
Page: 1346

Looking at Lucy Alice/Alice Lucy , just in case -

??
Alice Lucy Howe
in the London, England, Electoral Registers, 1832-1965
Name: Alice Lucy Howe
Electoral Date: 1914
Street Address: 25 Dunkeld street
Ward or Division/Constituency: Poplar
County or Borough: Tower Hamlets, England


Re the Shelter in Glaucus Street, where she was in 1911:

"Other articles also passed through the Council's apparatus, from the
Shelter, Glaucus Street, disinfectors' clothing, overalls, drop sheets, &c.,
to the number of 12,419, and 30,500 articles of clothing from verminous
persons were disinfested.
Making a total of 66,772 articles.
In addition thirteen boxes (maternity) and one bag were disinfected.
Twenty-eight articles were destroyed. "
https://tinyurl.com/38wsyrsm

Patricia -
To repeat what's been said before - you need a copy of David's birth cert to see exactly what it says.


IF Letherton is a mistake, and IF it should be Netherton, and IF Alice Lucy, the widow in 1911, is the right person, it's possible (and no more than that) that David is another man's son (ie - not Alfred John Howe, who died 1910), but still registered as Howe because that was still Alice/Lucy's name.

How does your cousin know his grandparents' names?
If he was told the names by David, it's possible that David didn't know his supposed father's full name, if he was brought up to believe he was Alfred John's son.

Was he brought up by his mother, or was he adopted?
Perhaps he was just going by what is (perhaps) written on the birth cert?

So many "maybe"s and possibilities.
Without further information, we're only guessing.

Wonder what happened to Lucy/Alice?

Findmypast has her born in 1881 as Lucy Alice. She's Lucy Alice in 1891 also.

Rose

That marriage has already been proved not to be relevant...and the woman was born in Gibraltar as per census info

NO other Howe/Letherton births in England/Wales

We need feedback from Patricia

Patricia's mother or father must have been a sibling of David.

Or is David only an uncle by marriage?

only a suggestion.


Surname Given Name District Volume Page
Marriages Jun 1905
HOWE Alfred John Woolwich 1d 1993


Surname Given Name District Volume Page
Marriages Jun 1905
Netherton Alice Lucy Woolwich 1d 1993.

A differene in spelling ,,,,,,cant see a birth for Alice L Letherton.

Did David G have siblings>

NO....not that marriage

1911

Name: Alice Lucy Howe
Age in 1911: 29
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1882
Relation to Head: Head
Gender: Female
Birth Place: Alt
Civil Parish: Poplar
Country: England
Street Address: The Shelter, Glaucus St, Bromley (Poplar Boro Depot, Yeo St)
Marital status: Widowed
Occupation: CARETAKER and MATRON OF INFECTIONS SHELTER
Registration District Number: 22
Sub-registration District: Bromley
ED, institution, or vessel: 28
Piece: 1705
Household Members:
Name Age
Alice Lucy Howe 29

Well, Howe certainly married Netherton.............

HOWE, RICHARD SAMUEL NETHERTON
GRO Reference: 1908 D Quarter in POPLAR Volume 01C Page 439

Name: Richard Samuel Howe
Baptism Age: 0
Record Type: Baptism
Birth Date: 11 Oct 1908
Baptism Date: 1 Nov 1908
Baptism Place: England, St Stephen, Tredegar Road, Tower Hamlets
Father: Alfred John Howe
Mother: Lucy Alice Howe


1911
Name: Richard Samuel Howe
Age in 1911: 2
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1909
Relation to Head: Grandchild
Gender: Male
Birth Place: London, United Kingdom
Civil Parish: Poplar
Country: England
Street Address: 26 Vernon Road, Bow, London E
Registration District Number: 22
Sub-registration District: Bow
ED, institution, or vessel: 17
Piece: 1667
Household Members:
Name Age
Amelia Baker 62
Priscilla Baker 26
Albert Ernest Baker 25
Jane Lucy Netherton 74
Mary Kathleen Howe 4
Richard Samuel Howe 2

Name: Richard Samuel Howe
Gender: Male
Marriage Age: 26
Birth Date: abt 1909
Marriage Place: Ingrave, St Nicholas, Essex, England
Marriage Date: 13 Apr 1935
Father: Alfred John Howe
Spouse: Lily Maria Williams



HOWE, MARY KATHLEEN NETHERTON
GRO Reference: 1907 M Quarter in POPLAR Volume 01C Page 488


Name: Alice Netherton
Age: 19
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1882
Relation to Head: Daughter
Gender: Female
Father: Samuel Netherton
Mother: Jane Netherton
Birth Place: Gibraltar*****************************************************
Civil Parish: Plumstead
Ecclesiastical parish: St James
County/Island: London
Country: England

Registration District: Woolwich
Sub-registration District: Plumstead West
ED, institution, or vessel: 04
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 570
Folio: 95
Page Number: 32
Household Schedule Number: 223
Household Members:
Name Age
Samuel Netherton 54
Jane Netherton 63
Alice Netherton 19


Name: Alfred John Howe
Gender: Male
Marriage Age: 26
Record Type: Marriage
Birth Date: abt 1879
Marriage Date: 16 Apr 1905
Marriage Place: St Margaret, Plumstead, Greenwich, England
Father: William Howe
Spouse: Alice Lacy Netherton

????

dont know who married who here

nearest i can find

Marriages Jun 1905 (>99%)
HOWE Alfred John Woolwich 1d 1993 xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Netherton Alice Lucy Woolwich 1d 1993 xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
SAMWAYS Alice Maria Woolwich 1d 1993
STRAW Sydney John Woolwich 1d 1993

Your cousin should get a copy of David's birth cert, if he doesn't already have it.

her wlll says she is a spinster
Howe

Lucy Ellen

—

1948

1949

England & Wales Government Probate Death Index 1858-2019

Dartford, Kent, England

That one is on 1939 register - single

This is the only likely death I could find:-

First name(s) Lucy E
Last name Howe
Gender Female
Birth day -
Birth month -
Birth year 1871
Age 77
Death quarter 4
Death year 1948
District Dartford
County Kent
Volume 5B
Page 476
Country England
Record set England & Wales Deaths 1837-2007

EDIT - may NOT be the right one as there is a birth in Dartford Kent in 1871 for a Lucy Ellen Howe.

Kath. x

No record anywhere on FMP for the name Lucy Letherton

When did she die?

cannot see any birth for lucy
only 2 letherton marriages on bmd both female

wonder if the name is misspelt

Do you know if Lucy Letherton had been married before she married John Howe?

I can't find a birth of a Lucy Letherton in England or Wales.

Kath. x

1939

34 Crystal Avenue, Hornchurch, Hornchurch U.D., Essex, England

David G Howe 11 Aug 1912 Male Metal Band Saw Machinist Heavy Worker Married 236 1
Elsie K Howe 16 Aug 1910 Female Unpaid Domestic Duties Married 236 2

Second forename Gordon