General Chat

Parents of Mary
Q:Who are Mary's parents?

A:The story of Mary's birth and details about her aging parents, Joachim and Anne, come from apocryphal writings known as the Protoevangelium of James the Lesser that was written by an unknown author. Apocryphal writings are often connected with Scriptural themes although they are not deemed part of the canon of the Catholic church.

The Rev. Bert Buby, S.M., a Marian scholar at the University of Dayton, calls the Protoevangelium account "a very imaginative, creative story about the birth of Mary, written about 150 A.D." In the beginning of the Protovangelium, Joachim is fasting in the wilderness and Anne is mourning in her garden, both of them lamenting their childlessness. An angel appears to Anne, promises her that she will conceive, and then directs her attention to her returning husband. Anne and Joachim share a tremendous embrace indicating their great confidence in God that a child will be born, and Anne does conceive. They dedicate their daughter, Mary, to God, keeping her from sin and evil. When she is three years old, Anne and Joachim present her in the temple, where Mary dances on the third step of the altar and "all the house of Israel loved her." Joseph is named as her protector when she reaches twelve or thirteen years of age. He's chosen as her betrothed after a sign from God--a dove came out of his staff.

The feast of the Birth of Mary is celebrated on Sept. 8, nine months after the Immaculate Conception. Joachim and Anne celebrate their feast day together on July 26. The feast of Mary's presentation in the temple is celebrated on Nov. 21.

Good morning :-)

...and good grief!! :-D

I thought I would nip on here and post for today before rushing off to get ready for church and what do I find?? A post which has been RR'd...someone having a baby at 80 (made me think of that lady in India this week and also Abraham and Sarah of course), the literal translation of the bible and then on to favourite hymns. I think I will go for a lie down and come back later as I know feel as old as Methuselah, but who's counting :-D :-D :-D


Nice to see so many popping in......all views welcome as long as they are expressed in a thoughtful and meaningful way <3


We have two baptisms today and the prep class was really interesting. The families had little to do with the faith to be honest, but that's not unusual, and we had a good bit of funny repartee. Hopefully, they will make the baptismal promises in honesty and truth.

The collect (special prayer) for today :

Almighty and everlasting God,
you are always more ready to hear than we to pray
and to give more than either we desire or deserve:
pour down upon us the abundance of your mercy,
forgiving us those things of which our conscience is afraid
and giving us those good things which we are not worthy to ask
but through the merits and mediation
of Jesus Christ your Son our Lord,
who is alive and reigns with you,
in the unity of the Holy Spirit,
one God, now and for ever.. Amen.


Cx :-)

Like others, I like different hymns for different reasons.
We too had a song of praise as our school hymn, - Praise to the Lord, the Almighty, the King of Creation. I quite like that one.

Lord of all hopefulness has been sung at family weddings and also funerals, so that has special linked memories too.

In more recent times, I've enjoyed the words of Lord for the Years, your love has kept and guided....... so I'm not sure that I could say that I have a favourite hymn.

The Rosary "During recitation of each set, thought is given to one of the Mysteries of the Rosary, which recall events in the lives of Jesus and Mary. ... The rosary also represents the Catholic emphasis on "participation in the life of Mary, whose focus was Christ", and the Mariological theme "to Christ through Mary."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immaculate_Conception

"In Christian theology, the Immaculate Conception is the conception of the Virgin Mary free from original sin by virtue of the merits of her son Jesus. The Catholic Church teaches that God acted upon Mary in the first moment of her conception, keeping her "immaculate".[1][2]

The Immaculate Conception is commonly confused with the virgin birth of Jesus, the latter being, rather, the doctrine of the Incarnation. While many Christians believe in the virgin birth of Jesus, it is principally Roman Catholics, along with various other Christian denominations, who believe in the doctrine of the Immaculate Conception.

Although the belief that Mary was sinless, or conceived without original sin, has been widely held since Late Antiquity, the doctrine was not dogmatically defined in the Catholic Church until 1854 when Pope Pius IX, declared ex cathedra, i.e., using papal infallibility, in his papal bull Ineffabilis Deus,[3] the Immaculate Conception to be doctrine"

The Rosary was a mystery to me with its repeated Hail Mary quoting the

Gospel of Luke, blessed art thou among women.,

Those using

the Rosary (I was told) are praying to Mary, not Jesus.

Apparently Mary, daughter of Anne was herself a mirical birth.

David ..........

please leave it alone

JoyLouise,
Sarah was 90 or 91 when Isaac was born, and she died at the age of 127. Sarah was 90 when Isaac was conceived, but there are some disparate records of her age at his birth. Still, it is only a matter of a very small amount of time, and she was either 90 or 91 when Isaac was born

Hello all (again)

Very difficult for me to choose a favourite hymn, I also like Abide with Me (had goosebumps singing this in the old Wembley Stadium for an FA Cup Final many years ago)...... Praise My Soul the King of Heaven is special as this was sung at our wedding, but When I Survey the Wondrous Cross is one that has me in tears at Lent..... the last verse.....

Were the whole realm of nature mine
That were an offering far too small
Love so amazing, so divine
Demands my soul, my life, my all........ the words get me every time.

A hymn that I have never really liked is Make Me a Channel of Your Peace, although the words are so beautiful and yet I groan inwardly when this is sung, like last Sunday in church.

David .....................

as a scientist, I cannot believe the Bible, especially the OT, as "true" as written.

However, there are ways of understanding what is being said if you think about it and realise that everything in those days was passed on by story tellers with very little written down.

Thus someone living 2000 years ago would not truly understand a time line of anything longer than a year ............... the passing of seasons was what they understand. So to try to explain something that happened over 1,000 or 1 billion years was just beyond comprehension.

Therefore a story teller simplified matters. People really understood what a day was, so they used 1 day as the time period that God took for each event.

BUT that time line is only a story, and not true.

Similarly, most people did not know how old they were because they could not count. Therefore, the story tellers again simplified things OR made things more dramatic. If a normal life span was 20 or 30 years, then someone having a baby at 20 was probably seen as being old ................ but drama is more effective when one say "80 years". That makes it beyond all comprehension.


I hope that I haven't offended anyone with my scientists' view. If so, I am very sorry.

Mine is Jerusalem ........ one apparently not in favour these days, but we sang it often at school.

Mine is I vow to thee my country when it is sung on Remembrance Day it makes me very tearful

My daughters favourite is The Old Rugged Cross but
she cannot sing or hear it without crying.

In general anything written that long ago will lose something in the many translations since and the meaning of the original words not fully comprehended and may be symbolic rather than factual?

There are sites where you can find interpretations of the Greek or Latin or Hebrew of the original texts, which can be enlightening.

Imho, (which is def' not orthodox and speaking only for myself) it is sometimes better to go with the spirit of the thing rather than the word. ie seven days to create the world? whose "days"? God's, or some limiting time frame humans invented to explain the sun rising and setting and the darkness in between and the word we apply to 24 hours?

Regarding "Abide with me" I know it tends to be used as a funeral hymn, but I find it very comforting and uplifting.

"....when other helpers fail and comforts flee,
help of the helpless, O abide with me."

David, really?

A baby at 80?

I don't have a favourite Vera but my daughter likes Abide with Me, Rose.

I remember being between her and friends at a funeral, one side gave a little groan when Abide with Me was announced but my daughter said what a lovely hymn with wonderful words it was.

There was one hymn, sung at my uncle's RC funeral in Liverpool several years ago that my OH really liked. Neither of us can remember its name but it was sung very softly and quietly and the gist was that the body would be made whole again, without any of the illness or injury that was there. To both of us it seemed to create an atmosphere of complete calm.

Although I know a lot of hymns, that is one I had not heard before and I'd really like to pin it down so if anyone knows, please tell me.

Also Abide with me and Nearer my God to Thee.

Thank you Vera, I hope I may be permitted to continue posting.

How does the reader of the OT & NT KNOW which texts are not literal ?

I do Vera, it's "Abide with me". :-)

I too am sure that David's doesn't mean to upset anybody and he is always most apologetic. Perhaps, David, you just need to think things through fully before posting and you might then decide that some items might be better put on a different thread. I would however hate to think that a Christian thread like this was not welcoming to all.

A lovely prayer today Kandj. Thank you.

I feel I am going slowly round the bend (nothing new there lol). I have had the hymn Blessed Assurance, Jesus is Mine going round and round my head for days and I cannot get rid of it. It's not even a favourite of mine but it set me wondering what is my favourite hymn. I've come to the conclusion I don't have one favourite but lots depending on my mood and what is on my mind at the time. One that seems to have been a part of my life in many ways is Praise My Soul the King of Heaven. It was sung on special occasions, such as Founder's Day, at my school, my daughter had it at her wedding, and my brother and I chose it for our father's funeral. What about you? Do you have a favourite hymn?

Hello all

Goodness me, in all the years that I have contributed to this Christian thread, I don't ever recall a post being RRd...... I could be wrong and somebody may correct me.

I really don't think that David would ever upset anybody intentionally. I'm off now to see if I can find the other thread that Emma is referring to.

Sharing a prayer for today:.............................

As the sun shines, may your hope shine in me,
As the birds sing, may your love flow out of me,
As your light shines throughout today, may your joy shine in me.
I come before you Oh Lord and and drink in this moment of peace,
That I might carry something of your hope, love and joy today in my heart.
Amen.

Have a good and blessed weekend everyone.