Genealogy Chat

I have been stuck for years on finding the first wife of William Fletcher b 1831 Dublin, Silversmith. He is my Grandfather x 2.

I have a record of him Census 1861 working as a Silver Plater in Staffordshire.

I have his daughters Therese Fletcher b 1864 London and Amy Fletcher b 1868 London.

He is with his daughters in Census 1871 staying as a visitor in Birmingham but no wife on record.

I have a second marriage for him in 1880 to Mary Ann House (Woodall).

I am in no need of information other than trying to find his two daughters' mother, so possibly a first marriage for him. Family history says that they were Irish and he does state that he is from Ireland.

I've been looking for ages but can't find a first marriage. Wondering if it's in Ireland yet he is possibly here in 1861 as a single man. I've looked at London marriages but haven't found one as yet. Haven't a birth record for him in Ireland either..

If anybody has the time to look I should be very grateful

:-) Many thanks for reading.

Have you got Birth Certs. of Daughters?...

Chris :)

(if Daughter below)

Birth
FLETCHER, THERESA (SHEA)
GRO Reference: 1864 D Quarter in SAINT JAMES'S WESTMINSTER Volume 01A Page 374

(not below, her Death 1863)

Births Jun 1862 (>99%)
------------------------------------------------------------
FLETCHER Theresa Jane St Giles 1b 406

I have Therese's birth certificate (she is definitely a Therese) but not Amy's. I don't know why I haven't been able to find hers? I only know what I found on the Census.

I have speculated that the mother has died but since I don't know the mother's name am unable to progress.

Many thanks, Chris Ho :) :-)

I have no idea if this is him?

UK Apprentices Indentured in Merchant Navy 1824 - 1910
William Fletcher
Birth Year - 1931
Age - 14 yrs
Indenture Date - 5 Feb 1845
Vessel - Delta
Remarks - Whitby

(A note scrawled over entry states 'Cancelled by mutual consent 2.2.47 (and a word am unable to read)

There is a previous similar record for him age 12 yrs

Your'e not being very clear on Birth of Theresa, do you mean you have the above Cert.?...(with Shea as Mother Maiden Name) or do you have another?...(you don't mention her first her name?)

Chris :)

1871 (Find My Past) (Reference)
Joseph Harriss Head (Glazier) Male 35 1836 - Worcestershire, England
Mary Ann Harriss Wife - Female 45 1826 - Staffordshire, England
William Fletcher Visitor (Silversmith) Male 40 1831 - Ireland (Dublin)
Theresa Fletcher Visitor - Female 6 1865 - Middlesex, England
Amy Fletcher Visitor - Female 3 1868 - Middlesex, England
New Canal Street Court House, Birmingham, Warwickshire,


1881 (Find My Past)
William Fletcher Head Married Male 50 1831 Silver Plater (Wh Mat) Ireland
Mary A Fletcher Wife Married Female 47 1834 Silver Plater (Wh Mat) Bridport, Dorset, England
Mary Woodhall Step Daughter Single Female 16 1865 Shop Keeper Bristol, Gloucestershire, England
Malinda Woodhall Step Daughter Single Female 14 1867 Apprentice Bristol, Gloucestershire, England
Amy Fletcher Daughter Single Female 12 1869 Scholar Middlesex, England
Richard Bees Father Law Married Male 85 1796 Flax Dresser Keynsham, Gloucestershire, England
Mary Bees Mother In Law Married Female 72 1809 - Bridport, Dorset, England
William Sage Lodger Single Male 25 1856 Quay Labourer Bristol, Gloucestershire, England
15, Lower Castle Street, Bristol Ss Philip and Jacob (In), Bristol, Gloucestershire,


Marriages Dec 1888 (>99%)
---------------------------------------------------
FLETCHER Therese Bristol 6a 105
WEBBER William Bristol 6a 105


1891 (Find My Past)
William Webber Head Married Male 24 1867 French Polisher -
Theresa Webber Wife Married Female 25 1866 Boot Fitter London, Middlesex (Soho) England
Easton Road, St Philip & St Jacob Out, Barton Regis, Gloucestershire

Thank you for drawing that to my attention, I hadn't found a Shea mmn record for Therese, though had the St James, Westminster location. .

Therese's daughters were all born in Bristol but it would appear her last child William Henry Webber b 1905 was born Prestwich, Manchester. The family did have links to the Manchester area so that is possible.

I knew that William Henry lost his mother when he was young but don't know what age. The only death I found was 1919 Fylde, Lancashire for Therese Webber but don't know if correct. We had thought that she died when he was younger than that.


Many thanks Chris Ho :) your kind help is very much appreciated.

I hadn't seen the Find My Past 1891 record, thank you!
:-)

If you have a copy of the Birth Cert. that would give Shea (Mother Maiden Name) also her First Name...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westminster_St_James

(above for area info.)

Chris :)

Edits

Baptism: 5 Jul 1905 St Alban, Cheetham, Lancashire, England
William Henry Webber - [Child] of William Webber & Therese
Born: 25 May
Abode: 54 Northgraves Street
Occupation: French Polisher
Baptised by: Arthur H.M. Hope
Register: Baptisms 1882 - 1914, Page 146, Entry 1167
Source: LDS Film 1408887

http://www.lan-opc.org.uk/Search/indexp.html


1911 (Find My Past)
William Webber Head Married Male French Polisher 46 1865 Bristol St Philip
Therese Webber Wife Married Female - 46 1865 London
Amy Gladys Webber Daughter Single Female Machinist Costumers 18 1893 Bristol Newtown
Lilian Therese Webber Daughter Single Female Machinist Blouses 15 1896 Bristol Newtown
William Webber Son - Male - 5 1906 Manchester Lanc
87 Peter St Broughton Salford, Broughton, Lancashire,


https://tinyurl.com/y7ole3p9

(1919 Terese Webber. Find A Grave. Southern Cemetery. Manchester)


Deaths Sep 1919 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------
Webber Teres[ae] 54 Fylde 8e 577


http://www.burialrecords.manchester.gov.uk/

(above also has Burial)

Thank you Chris, I hadn't realised that if I ordered the birth certificate the mmn would be there.
i thought that the mmn wasn't available before a certain time. Will order that today, thank you so much :-)

https://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/login.asp

(you can now get Maiden Name on above)

Chris :)

Thank you very much, I wasn't aware of that :-)

I haven't been able to find a birth for Amy. Doesn't appear to be the Clerkenwell birth..

On the 1861 census, William is listed as a widower.

Could this maybe be Amy in 1891 ???

(I know you don't want info other than her mother's name, but just trying to find a more accurate birthplace.)



Amy Fletcher
in the 1891 England Census
Name: Amy Fletcher
Gender: Female
Age: 23
Relationship: Boarder
Birth Year: 1868
Birth Place: Soho, London, England
Civil Parish: St George
Ecclesiastical parish: St Lawrence
Residence Place: St George, St George, Gloucestershire, England
Registration district: Barton Regis
Sub registration district: St George
ED, Institution or Vessel: 16
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 1977
Folio: 10
Household Members:
Name Age
Henry Wallace 42
Rose Wallace 41
Louisa Wallace 20
Agnes Wallace 14
Charles Wallace 13
Amy Fletcher 23 - dress stay machinist
Susan Hill 22

Thank you both AustinQ and Argyll Gran.. so Helpful!

That is definitely our Amy in Bristol. The family are in the Barton Regis area and she was very likely a machinist.

:-D

It is very likely that Amy Fletcher b 1868 Soho married in Scotland, her daughters were brought up in Glasgow.

If I order the paper copy of Therese's birth certificate through GRO rather than the online, will that have the mother's maiden name also, please?

Lavender- hold on!

If Amy married in Scotland the marriage certificate will tell you her parents names. I have some credits, I'll take a look.

OK

Amy did marry in Scotland in 1902 - her parents are listed-:

Marriage:23rd December 1902 Blackfriars, Glasgow

Name: Amy Fletcher
Age: 28
Usual Residence: 76 Gallowgate
Father: William Fletcher, electroplater, deceased
Mother: Catherine Fletcher, maiden surname O'Shea, deceased

Spouse: John O'niel (General Labourer)
age: 35
Usual Residence: 76 Gallowgate
Father: Hugh O'neil (shoemaker journeyman)
Mother: Susannah Burke, formerly O'neil, previously Reston, (maiden surname Dodgson?)
----------------------------

Amy died in 1917 Cathcart (her parents on the death entry are listed the same as the marriage entry). Her sister, Therese Webber registered the death.

Looking good there AQ...

Chris :)

Deaths Sep 1881 (>99%)
---------------------------------------------------
FLETCHER William 49 Bristol 6a 19


29 September 1881 - Western Daily Press - Bristol, Bristol, England

Found Dead In Bed
Yesterday afternoon, Mr. H.S. Wasbrough held an inquest at the Rising Sun public-house, Lower Castle Street, touching the death of William Fletcher, silver plater, who lately resided at 15, Lower Castle Street, Bristol. Mary Ann Fletcher, wife of the deceased stated that she sat up with her mother who was ill on Tuesday night in an adjoining room to the deceased's bedroom, and when she went to call him in the morning to go to his work she found he was dead. In reply to the Coroner, witness said that about a fortnight ago the deceased had a fit at the Mission Hall, and on two previous occasions he had similar attacks. A young daughter of the deceased having stated that she had slept with her father on the night in question, and was not disturbed during the night, the Coroner said that according to the evidence the deceased had fits occasionally, and it was extremely probable that he had an attack in the night, and that the action of the heart suddenly stopped, The jury returned a verdict of accidental death.

Oh Gosh!! I can't thank you enough. So silly I never thought to even think of finding the names on their daughter's marriage certificate.

I can't thank you enough xx :-D :-D :-D