Genealogy Chat

Even better, ArgyllGran, thank you for that!

That Sarah in 1881 was born in Wilts - which fits with the Trowbridge birthplace stated in 1891 census.

If Frank's age is supposed to be 11 months, written as years by mistake,
that would fit more or less with the 1880 birth.

The 1881 census also says he was born in Shipbourne - which was in Malling reg district, which again matches the birth record.

That's Interesting ArgyllGran, I hadn't thought of looking up the address. Prospect Place seems to have disappeared by 1891, the Letchfords are living elsewhere and a search for "Prospect" in Sevenoaks gives no results. Not sure what to make of that yet.

William & Sarah were together in 1891.

And what about this:

Name: William Wickens
Age: 27
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1854
Relationship to Head: Head
Gender: Male
Where born: Rotherfield, Sussex, England
Civil Parish: Tonbridge
County/Island: Kent
Country: England
Street Address: Modest Corner
Marital status: Married <<<
Education:
Employment status:
View image
Occupation: Agl Lab
Registration District: Tunbridge
Sub registration district: Tunbridge Wells
ED, institution, or vessel: 29a
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 917
Folio: 79
Page Number: 44
Household Members:
Name Age
William Wickens 27
Sarah Pauling 22
Frank Pawling 11

Pawling sounds like Rawling(s)?

Could the "11" be a mis-transcription by the enumerator? It would make more sense - Sarah could have had a child at 11 but it's improbable, and it agrees with the birth record I have found. Am I bending the facts to fit?

Only the mother can answer those questions

Thanks Erika

I agree "a cook" could well be her occupation, but it looks more to me like "a Cook" ie capitalised which might suggest a name?

I realise that the implication of no father's name is usually that the child is illegitimate, however in this case there was apparently a child (Frank) born two years previously who was legitimate (father's name = Wickens) and there were also children born afterwards who had a father's name = Wickens, so why was Florence recorded without a father's name? William Wickens denied that the child was his yet subsequently referred to her as Daughter?

Sarah Jane wasn't at 12 Prospect Place (her address on the 1882 birth cert) in 1881:

John T. Luetchford
in the 1881 England Census
Name: John T. Luetchford
[John T. Letchford]
Age: 2
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1879
Relationship to Head: Son
Father: John Letchford
Mother: Martha Letchford
Gender: Male
Where born: Sevenoaks, Kent, England
Civil Parish: Sevenoaks
County/Island: Kent
Country: England
Street Address: 12 Prospect Place <<<<<<<<<<<<<
Education:
Employment status:
View image
Registration District: Sevenoaks
ED, institution, or vessel: 4
Neighbors:
Piece: 907
Folio: 86
Page Number: 3
Household Members:
Name Age
John Letchford 32
Martha Letchford 30
William G. Luetchford 9
Ellen J. Luetchford 6
Henry C. Luetchford 5
John T. Luetchford 2
Arthur N. Luetchford

I agree - "a cook".

Looks like 'a Cook' - occupation?

The father's name is missing because the child was illegitimate.

I have now received the GRO record for Florence Ada Rawlings birth, which confirms Shirley's conclusion. The birth date matches the one in the 1939 record. Thank you again, Shirley.

It raises a couple of further questions however. Under the mother's name, Sarah Jane Rawlings, there's what looks like a lower case a or d, and then below that "Cook". I don't recall seeing anything like this before and I wonder whether anyone can suggest how to interpret it? You can see the image here:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/bgv019c46oj1p24/COL277107_2021-1-Florence_Ada_Rawlings.pdf?dl=0

Then there's the C1891 showing Florence and Frank:

Name: William Wickens
Gender: Male
Age: 36
Relationship: Head
Birth Year: 1855
Spouse: Sarah Wickens
Child: Frank Wickens
Florence Wickens
Williams Wickens
Emily Wickens
Fred Wickens
Birth Place: Banghlfeald
Civil Parish: Tunbridge
Ecclesiastical parish: St Peter
Residence Place: Southborough, Tunbridge, Kent, England
Registration District: Tunbridge
Sub registration district: Tunbridge Wells
ED, Institution or Vessel: 28
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 680
Folio: 62
Household Members:
Name Age
William Wickens 36
Sarah Wickens 31
Frank Wickens 10 <<< difficult to read but compares with Frank higher up the page
Florence Wickens 8
Williams Wickens 7
Emily Wickens 6
Fred Wickens 3

Note that Frank was born 2 years before Florence.

I'd previously thought that this was Frank's birth:

WICKENS, FRANK RAWLINGSON
GRO Reference: 1880 J Quarter in MALLING Volume 02A Page 598

Rawlingson being very close to Rawlings, and the birth date being in the right quarter. But that raises the question: why no father's name on the birth registration for Florence?

Which lead to this possible christening:

Name: Frank Wickens
Gender: Male
Birth Date: 14 Apr 1880 <<<
Baptism Date: 13 Jun 1880
Baptism Place: Rothfield, Sussex, England
Father:
Amos Wickens
Mother:
Eliza
FHL Film Number: 1067280
Reference ID: item 8 p 56

Which made me wonder whether Frank was "farmed out" to William and Sarah Jane? But no, this Frank is with Amos & Eliza in Rotherfield in C1891 so it's unlikely he was also in Tunbridge Wells - see the above census.

So I'm left wondering why the father's name was missing from the birth registration.

I have yet to find a believable marriage for Sarah Jane Rawlings and William Wickens - perhaps they did not marry?

Thank you ArgyllGran. I came to the same conclusion but it was terribly tempting to try and force the family to travel between Leicester and Tonbridge ;-)

Keith

Just to add -

It's just coincidence that both Wickens families - the correct Kent one and the incorrect Leicester one - have daughters named Florence Ada of roughly the same age.

You posted 1881 for the Leicester family.

Here they are in 1891:

William Wickens
in the 1891 England Census
Name: William Wickens
Gender: Male
Age: 40
Relationship: Head
Birth Year: 1851
Spouse: Sarah Wickens
Child: Mabel A Wickens
Evelyn M Wickens
Oscar W Wickens
Birth Place: Goldington, Bedfordshire, England
Civil Parish: St Margaret
Ecclesiastical parish: St Peter
Residence Place: St Margaret, Leicestershire, England
Registration District: Leicester
Sub registration district: East Leicester
ED, Institution or Vessel: 18
Neighbors:
Piece: 2526
Folio: 28
Household Members:
Name Age
William Wickens 40
Sarah Wickens 36 - Belton, Rutland
Mabel A Wickens 8 - Leicester
Evelyn M Wickens 3 - Leicester
Oscar W Wickens 1 - Leicester


WICKENS, OSCAR WILLIAM mmn SPENCER
GRO Reference: 1889 D Quarter in LEICESTER Volume 07A Page 244


So this is the Leicester Florence Ada:

WICKENS, FLORENCE ADA mmn SPENCER
GRO Reference: 1879 S Quarter in LEICESTER Volume 07A Page 246

Oh brilliant, Shirley, that has to be it!

RAWLINGS, FLORENCE ADA -
GRO Reference: 1882 J Quarter in SEVENOAKS Volume 02A Page 626

And that may well be as close as we'll come to the "correct" family name.

Thank you!

Keith

Not seeing a death for a Sarah wickens pre 1901

Wonder on this one

Jun 1899
Rawlinson Sarah 41 Tunbridge 2a 435

Not seeing a birth reg for Florence Ada Wickens


Wonder on this one

RAWLINGS, FLORENCE ADA -
GRO Reference: 1882 J Quarter in SEVENOAKS Volume 02A Page 626

Yes, that C1911 was where this all began. It's actually the Mephams I'm tracing and Ethel married a Mepham. To find her parents I had to investigate all of her siblings and I'm still not there!!

And yes, I think you're right, another spending spree with the GRO is called for!!

Keith

1911 census

Charles Cheeseman
Age in 1911: 31
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1880
Relation to Head: Head
Gender: Male
Birth Place: Woking, Surrey, England
Civil Parish: Horsell
Search Photos: Search for 'Horsell' in the UK City, Town and Village Photos collection
Country: England
Street Address: Hensbury Cottage, Horsell Common Woking, Surrey
Marital status: Married
Occupation: Machinist
Registration District Number: 32
Sub-registration District: Chobham
ED, institution, or vessel: 03
Piece: 3017
Household Members:
Name Age
Charles Cheeseman 31
Florance Cheeseman 28
Maud Cheeseman 3
Ethel Wickens 19 sister in law born Tunbridge


WICKENS, ETHEL RAWLINSON
GRO Reference: 1892 M Quarter in TONBRIDGE Volume 02A Page 668


Marriages Jun 1906 (>99%)
CHEESMAN Charles Tonbridge 2a 1586
Wickens Florence Ada Tonbridge 2a 1586

There doesn’t seem to be a marriage either

Guess the only way is to buy one of the certs for its info

err... what about this for William?

WICKENS, WILLIAM JOHN ROLLINSON
GRO Reference: 1883 D Quarter in SEVENOAKS Volume 02A Page 622

And I wis-wrote:

Looking at the available records for the other children (eg William, Fred) there doesn't seem to be anything similar.

Should have been:

Looking at the available records for the other children (eg William, Florence) there doesn't seem to be anything similar.

Keith

Thank you Shirley!

Yes, I'd found most of those, hence my comment in my initial post about "MMN = Rollings, Rawlings, Rawlinson" - although I hadn't spotted Emily = Emma, thank you very much for that!

However I was unable to find records for the other children with MMN in the same "group".

This feels like a step forwards. I'd tentatively grouped the Rawlings et al names and put the variation down to how the name was spoken at the time of registration. It gives me some confidence that you have the same inclination.

Looking at the available records for the other children (eg William, Fred) there doesn't seem to be anything similar.

And I have not yet found a marriage for Wickens + Rawlings or variants ...

Thank you again!

Keith

Fred

They didn’t complete the name I think

WICKENS, FRED RAWLINGS
GRO Reference: 1888 M Quarter in SEVENOAKS Volume 02A Page 673